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Raiden

Gang Capacity Changes

483 posts in this topic

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Gang Capacity Changes

There has been much discussion regarding this subject on the forums, within the community and within the staff team. It has previously been mentioned to be implemented with the upcoming framework, however we feel that this may need to be implemented sooner rather than later.

With this said, we will be implementing a gang capacity of 12 members per server. To elaborate on this, a gang can have a maximum of 12 players on a server at a time. This number is not set in stone and has some wiggle room depending on the reaction to this cap. Gangs can still have 36 members on at one time split over the 3 servers (12 per server).

We hope that this will help gangs work together as opposed to mass recruiting and being their own faction within the server, from speaking to players from all sides it appears that a large amount of players feel that the servers are currently a "numbers" game, meaning that skill is outweighed by sheer numbers within a gang.

We understand that people enjoy playing this game with their friends and we in no way want to change this, however we find many gangs "mass recruiting" bringing in a large amount of players, it then goes from a group of friends to an army of associates, nothing is stopping the smaller gangs grouping together for runs or banks, so you can still play with friends in other gangs just as you always have been able to, however if gangs are seen constantly grouping an essentially playing as a large gang with two separate tags action will be taken against them.

This will hopefully see a start in many new gangs, gangs will be able to show true strength in roleplay and combat from these smaller gangs, it will also build gang spirit with more gangs on the server.

This will aid the smaller rebel gangs who struggle to fight these large gangs as I have personally witnessed first hand, the dominant gangs on the server are holding the smaller gangs back so it turns to a choice of either join the larger gangs or stay as a small gang and continue to lose money.

The only exception is when a gang decides to rob the royal mint, provided you log on, gear up then proceed to the mint, once it's completed and the vehicles and money are safe you must then disperse.

New rule

A new rule will be implemented which we hope players will adhere to.

5.9: Rebel gangs can only have a maximum of 12 players on a server at one time, the gang can have 12 players on each of the servers. The only exception to this is when a gang is robbing the Royal Mint.

Conclusion

As always we are interested to hear your feedback regarding this change, we understand that some of you will be displeased with this change but understand it is in the best interests of the server as a whole. Give it a chance to settle before exploding.

Please keep the replies constructive, and offer any suggestions you may have.

Many thanks,

The staff team.

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Kinda cool IMO, but Im worried gangs will split but still be in the same channel and cooperation under the same tags

 

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6 minutes ago, Raiden said:

 

5.9: Rebel gangs can only have a maximum of 12 players on a server at one time, the gang can have 12 players on each of the servers. The only exception to this is when a gang is robbing the Royal Mint.

 

This doesn't count for the Neochori bank I see, so blufor always outnumbers a gang that robs the Neochori bank thus has a huge advantage over them. I suggest adding the Neochori Bank to this.

Edited by Ikkeme

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This will be interesting, hopefully turns into something good :P

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1 minute ago, Ikkeme said:

This doesn't count for the Neochori bank I see, so blufor always outnumbers a gang that robs the Neochori bank thus has a huge advantage over them.

A bank is ment to be hard to pull of, but indeed Neo is a hobo bank and BLUEFOR always gets out the big guns. Even if it are just PDW hobos

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1 minute ago, Ikkeme said:

This doesn't count for the Neochori bank I see, so blufor always outnumbers a gang that robs the Neochori bank thus has a huge advantage over them. I suggest adding the Neochori Bank to this.

The hope is gangs will rob the Neochori with 12 members and the Police can respond appropriately. It will be monitored closely and if the Police are responding with too much force then we'll look into the problem with @30K.

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Just now, Ikkeme said:

This doesn't count for the Neochori bank I see, so blufor always outnumbers a gang that robs the Neochori bank thus has a huge advantage over them.

Now we can regulate gang sizes turning up to Neochori, it will be far easier to control the cops going to Neo.

Cops send 15 people to Neo, then get ruined by 40 rebels with ifrits. They learn their lesson.

The next time they get a Neo, they bring 40 cops with hunters, but this time it's 7 hobos robbing it.
It's an endless cycle, with less rebels robbing the bank we can put a limit on cop response numbers.
Neo was never supposed to be robbed by the large gangs, it was supposed to be for smaller players, the large gangs took it as their own, hence, police response it hard.

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I really don't think this is a very good idea for a number of reasons, you nerf small gangs (heli runs) then buff them by limiting gangs playing together? You can basically count out anybody winning a neo now also.

Edited by Cj1999

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Just now, DnA said:

The hope is gangs will rob the Neochori with 12 members and the Police can respond appropriately. It will be monitored closely and if the Police are responding with too much force then we'll look into the problem with @30K.

Oh, GG. So you guys are trying to get Neo back to hobos/ small gangs?

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Just now, rubenyoranpc said:

Oh, GG. So you guys are trying to get Neo back to hobos/ small gangs?

Where it belongs.

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5 minutes ago, Cj1999 said:

I really don't think this is a very good idea for a number of reasons, you need small gangs (heli runs) then buff them by limiting gangs playing together? You can basically count out anybody winning a neo now also.

5.8: Backpack runs: It is against server rules to complete runs in a helicopter just using a backpack, if you wish to complete a run with a helicopter you must purchase a box to transfer the materials.

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3 minutes ago, DnA said:

The hope is gangs will rob the Neochori with 12 members and the Police can respond appropriately. It will be monitored closely and if the Police are responding with too much force then we'll look into the problem with @30K.

So there will be put a maximum to the amount of responsive blufor, for example 15. And when they are all dead the bank has been won and can only be overtaken by other gangs?

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2 minutes ago, Cj1999 said:

I really don't think this is a very good idea for a number of reasons, you nerf small gangs (heli runs) then buff them by limiting gangs playing together?

The whole idea is that is gives small gangs a chance to stand up to bigger gangs. And 12 members active isnt a small gang anymore. So you now can do truck runs with less of a risk and more chance of winning

 

3 minutes ago, Cj1999 said:

 You can basically count out anybody winning a neo now also.

This:

4 minutes ago, DnA said:

The hope is gangs will rob the Neochori with 12 members and the Police can respond appropriately. It will be monitored closely and if the Police are responding with too much force then we'll look into the problem with @30K.

 

4 minutes ago, Ikkeme said:

So there will be put a maximum to the amount of responsive blufor, for example 15. And when they are all dead the bank has been won and can only be overtaken by other gangs?

Nah man, the cop channel always go like this:"If you die, log out so colleages can log in"

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9 minutes ago, rubenyoranpc said:

Nah man, the cop channel always go like this:"If you die, log out so colleages can log in"

Well give the APC also some time to change their mindset to this.

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Just now, Kichiro said:

Well give the APC also some time to change their mindset to this.

APC do this for the mint with 35 of them so why would it change for neos

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I personally do not believe this was needed however I respect your guys' decision. However left shift our focus from the Neochori/Royal Mint situations. If a full rebel gang is doing a cocaine run and has 8 trucks and a couple of other gang members either in helis or deployed in the ground. The APC usually asks for full backup (no point in denying it, it does happen) when they see a good number of trucks doing illegal runs. So let's say that the APC responds with more ore less 20 cops + backup from NATO, this automatically will leave the rebels in a great disadvantage no matter what way the fight goes. I hope I expressed myself correctly.

PS. Is there going to be a system implemented in-game that will only allow 12 members and as soon as they want to start a bank they can invite more people?
PS2. Can't this be slightly abused by APC/NATO as they can see whenever gang members are connecting and the numbers are higher than 12?

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8 minutes ago, Cj1999 said:

APC do this for the mint with 35 of them so why would it change for neos

Then @30K can have a look to there mindset and maybe chance it. like it was before in my time there that people say that but you could say no because they can't force you to log off to give your spot to someone else. After you die you would go back to a normal patrol. So all partys need to ajust to this chance so give some time to do so. Time will tell what need to be done.

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5 minutes ago, Dante said:

I personally do not believe this was needed however I respect your guys' decision. However left shift our focus from the Neochori/Royal Mint situations. If a full rebel gang is doing a cocaine run and has 8 trucks and a couple of other gang members either in helis or deployed in the ground. The APC usually asks for full backup (no point in denying it, it does happen) when they see a good number of trucks doing illegal runs. So let's say that the APC responds with more ore less 20 cops + backup from NATO, this automatically will leave the rebels in a great disadvantage no matter what way the fight goes. I hope I expressed myself correctly.

PS. Is there going to be a system implemented in-game that will only allow 12 members and as soon as they want to start a bank they can invite more people?
PS2. Can't this be slightly abused by APC/NATO as they can see whenever gang members are connecting and the numbers are higher than 12?

Of course all good things take time, hopefully over a small amount of time the cops will only be responding to their own districts meaning more cops all over the map instead of all in one place fighting one gang.

There is not currently a system in place blocking players from having a large gang, we are hoping you will adhere to the limit as we would rather not remove that feature from you, however if we repeatedly see gangs going against this rule then something may have to change to lock players to 12 members.

Yeah whilst it can slightly be abused by APC/NATO as they can see the gang logging on in large numbers, it is very rare that a mint is a shock, most of the time the APC/NATO have whispered calling a bank well in advance, police shouldn't be preparing for the bank before the alarm either way, as it would be considered metagaming.

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Whilst I understand the concern and reasoning behind this rule, I really dont like it.

It takes away the fun and casualness of playing a game with friends. There's not that many huge gangs, currently I guess its BLACK, TI and TRN that regularly field more than 12 players. TI hasnt recruited in ages and usually has less than 12. So now when I come home from work and just want to relax with friends, I need to count first and if theres 12 already I'll be left out. There's no way people are gonna divide over 2 servers if theyre in the middle of something already or have to go server 2 with just the 2 of them.

On top of that, it would need some serious rules for blufor too. Currently if you do a big truckrun you simply need more than 12 since the cops tend to call everyone in and have login squads at the ready. 12 vs 30 isnt exactly fair.

But mostly I just want to play with friends unconcerned. Its not like theres always 12 people on so you can divide by 2 x 6. It usually starts with 2 or 3 people logging on then the rest comes on until theres 12. Now these people are already doing something so theyre not logging onto another server, meaning that the players 13 and 14 are left out and will play something else.

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That is a great change, I like it.

I hope Neuchori will be balanced somehow in the meantime.

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40 minutes ago, rubenyoranpc said:

Nah man, the cop channel always go like this:"If you die, log out so colleages can log in"

Now it will be the same thing with rebels.

 

22 minutes ago, Raiden said:

Of course all good things take time, hopefully over a small amount of time the cops will only be responding to their own districts meaning more cops all over the map instead of all in one place fighting one gang.

Let's face it, everyone loves combat situations and meanwhile this is a roleplay server it's also on a combat oriented game so it's unrealistic to expect for some cops to not respond or react to a combat situation if there's 30 of them online just because 20 cops have already responded to a fight against 12 rebels and what will happen if those 20 cops so happen to be wiped by the 12 rebels? I don't suppose the 10 extra cops out on normal patrol are expected to not respond? Seizing drugs is one of the very few ways Blufor makes money so everyone is going to want a piece of the pie once they find out there's a convoy of trucks doing a drug run; meanwhile I somewhat understand the need for a gang cap I don't see how this change is going make combat against Blufor more so of a skill based game over a numbers game - which is afterall one of the objectives this change is meant to achieve. In conclusion perhaps 12 is too low of a number to expect to come out on top against Blufor though I do see the positives this will bring to fights between rebels.

Edited by AbdieFlappyfeet

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This is a nice change for rebel v rebel but I do believe bluefor will need some tweaking now as well because I can only imagine 20+ bluefor responding to 12 people doing a run (2-3 rebels driving trucks so they aren't as effective).

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I think the hole reason we have this big gangs is because gangs where overwelmt by bleufor and rebels feel they  can't win without the numbers so reduce the numbers off rebels will encourage more robbing during peak time and less runs because rebels think they make no chance against  30 bleufor WWhit2 or 3 login squads 

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I like the new gang chance.... becaue i expect more Royal mint robbery's and i think it will make it alot more fun on both sides!!!

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1 hour ago, Raiden said:

Now we can regulate gang sizes turning up to Neochori, it will be far easier to control the cops going to Neo.

Cops send 15 people to Neo, then get ruined by 40 rebels with ifrits. They learn their lesson.

The next time they get a Neo, they bring 40 cops with hunters, but this time it's 7 hobos robbing it.
It's an endless cycle, with less rebels robbing the bank we can put a limit on cop response numbers.
Neo was never supposed to be robbed by the large gangs, it was supposed to be for smaller players, the large gangs took it as their own, hence, police response it hard.

I Think this is why this is a good chance to the gang related stuff.... i hope it get more balanced in the future.... and if they like to do a big bank they need to do royal mint! +1 from me......

About APC on patrol in theri own destriction is hard but i think we are making progres in that and we here it all the time at the meetings....   So if all happens from APC and Rebels side it will be more balanced and more fun for both sides!!!

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